Perhaps Strayhorn's masterful condensation might be compared to Gil Evans's rethinking of Concierto de Aranjuez? Rodrigo was apparently appalled by the "blasphemy." But I can't imagine any jazz listener, or serious student of composition, agreeing with him. Evans fleshed out the ideas that were merely hints in the "original," in particular turning the ominously static development section into a full-blown and coherent narrative. Perhaps Strayhorn, too, undertood the composer's ideas better than the composer...
I think the prejudice persists, almost unconsciously, that classical composers, trained in Fux and Salieri, are per se more accomplished at dealing with musical form than their jazz counterparts, trained in, er, Skinnay Ennis and Billy May. Among the profusion of examples that confute this presumption, Gil Evans's rethinking of Rodrigo is toward the top of the heap..
Any comments on John Coltrane’s long form ASCENSION? It’s worth seeking out in the 2 CD box set The Major Works of John Coltrane because it has both takes (aka edition 1 & 2), the LP was issued, and then Coltrane changed his mind and asked Impulse to make subsequent pressings using the other take (which was done).
Yes I like it of course. In a way this is a good example of spontaneous form. John Tchicai's comparatively soft and lyrical solos change the feeling of the music entirely
As far as I know, the issue of long-form in jazz goes back to Andre Hodier at midcentury and got a lot of mileage out of discussion of Ellington's various suites. I've always thought the issue was ill-posed in some way, but I've never thought it through.
And then we have something like Mingus's Black Saint and Sinner Lady which was, in effect, composed in the editing bay. But then, many films get shaped the same way. I thinking particulary of Apocalypse Now, which never really had a screen play, and was edited into coherence after who knows how may thousands of feet of film was shot.
I can't imagine anyone would think that discussions of form in jazz, long form or otherwise, have been among the happier chapters in its discursive history. The routine sneering at the handling of form in Duke Ellington's Suites have been just as routinely--and rightly?--denounced as, well, extremely blinkered at best, and racist at worst.
At the risk of pretentiousness, I think the problem (or one of the principal ones) is a confusion of form and structure. Since the latter has always been basic and clear in most jazz, it has unwisely presumed to be equivalent to the former. Yet we all *know* that isn't so. To suggest that the "form" of "C Jam Blues" and "Chasin' the Train" are "the same" because they both involve the 12-bar blues *structure* is absurd. But we all do it; out of laziness, and out of the formidable challenge of disentangling musical form in its truest sense from the structures that enable it.
André Hodeir took something of an interesting step in the right direction in trying to differentiate the function of different choruses. He called what's normally called "playing the head" the "paraphrase chorus," and the succeeding choruses "improvising choruses" (something like that, I think; I don't have his book any more.) Calling that a paraphrase chorus instead of a "melody statement" sharply alters our view of its function in the whole performance. If only we could follow up on his insights, and figure out what the hell is going on *formally* with the rest of the choruses!
thanks for comment. It's true that long forms in jazz are problematic. In the end, what makes up so much of what I love in "modern jazz" is group interaction. In many cases long forms are developed organically, but there's hardly any terminology to discuss that.
Right. That is, a performance evolves so that it has a "long line" that no one planned or intended, but it's how things worked out. Working groups can arrive at such things and then re-enact them reliably on different occasions. But it doesn't have to be a working group. It can simply be a group who happen to be playing together and know how to listen and relate.
One thing I am a little perplexed by is calling "Handful of Keys" source material. To my ears (and hands), "Handful of Keys" (1929) is partially rooted in the so-called "novelty" piano stylings of Zez Confrey, Arthur Schutt, etc. "Kitten on the Keys" (1921) comes to mind. I hear it in other Fats Waller pieces, such as "Smashing Thirds" and pieces by other stride pianists. We know that Gershwin was also influenced by Zez Confrey and that Confrey was included in the 1924 Aeolian Hall concert where he played several of his pieces, including "Kitten on the Keys."
I'm not sure when Waller and Gershwin met, but I know they were friends and admired each other, so there must have been influence in both directions (perhaps "I Got Rhythm" comes from "Handful of Keys"?......I'd be interested to know when these changes first appeared). I find it hard to believe that Fats wasn't checking out "Rhapsody in Blue."
Is "Handful of Keys" better than "Rhapsody in Blue"? In my opinion, yes, by a mile. But "Handful" was also a piece for show, mixing novelty tricks into a stride piano foundation. I suppose calling it source material depends on the definition. Is it authoritative? Absolutely. Is it it original? Maybe?
Thanks for detailed comment. There's little doubt that Gershwin heard Waller in Harlem before composing the Rhapsody. However, the particular point Aaron Diehl is raising relates to SOURCE in terms of RHYTHM. Most classical pianists couldn't play more than a few beats of any of those three pieces. Waller had one of the best feels, and "Handful of Keys" is a virtuoso example of Waller's groove. That's the puzzle piece -- the source -- we all need to study to keep American music moving forward.
I dig Zez Confrey and Arthur Schutt too, BTW. So much great piano music from that era.
Ok, for some reason, it wasn't clear to me that we were only talking about rhythm, but I do agree that Fats had one of the best (if not THE best) grooves in history.
I was considering the harmonic/melodic picture, as well. I think there's a tendency to talk about the European influence on jazz harmony while overlooking the harmonic sophistication and originality of musicians like James P Johnson and Fats Waller. I think of them as both rhythmic and harmonic sources. I've probably learned half of what I know about harmony from James P. Johnson.
I guess that's why I pick on "Handful of Keys" a bit, because harmonically and melodically, it's in the realm of novelty works by people like Confrey and Gershwin. Fats was also a harmonic giant, and there are many better examples of his full scope. How about that solo version of "Honeysuckle Rose" from 1941? Or his hauntingly beautiful "My Fate is In Your Hands"?
Maybe it's just me being tired of hearing about "Handful of Keys" when Fats Waller gave us so much more.
BTW, thanks for opening up this conversation! It's a good one!
Well those pieces were Aaron's choices. I doubt he thought about much about it one way or the other in the quick interview. I'm sure we all love the harmony AND the rhythm of these great masters.
OK my case for the Beethoven 9th Symphony finale rests on the bit where the soloists sing "... And the cherubs will stand before God," and he has them repeat, "BEFORE GOD!" And then everything stops and a damned Turkish parade comes right through the middle of the piece. Which to me is Beethoven saying, "I mean it about how we'll all get our face time with God," and is basically Mahler avant la lettre.
Bachianas Brasileiras No. 5 has always been a favorite. A la Rodrigo/Gil Evans, there have been a number of interpretations by jazz artists. Bradford's version followed the "light classical" approach, as promised in the label name --- a respectable but mainstream performance. The Modern Jazz Quartet definitely took a jazzier tack, but it's clunky to my ears. The best interpretation I've heard is Wayne Shorter's take on his "Alegria" album 20 years ago. It's a hybrid, with a gorgeous cello ensemble and Wayne soaring in an improvisation on the melody. I did it in a recital a couple of decades ago and couldn't hit that last high note today if I tried. Are there other versions out there that transform it but stay true to its Brazilian origins? Is it in your repertoire?
That is a beautiful piece and you’re right about the connection to the jazz musicians. I’ve never played it myself. The (original?) version with cellos is breathtaking
(Unrelated to the above) People still namecheck and respect John Lewis, but I don't hear his musical influence as much as I might like, especially in terms of composition and arrangement (rather than piano playing). For EI or anyone else, can you recommend contemporary composers or recordings that you hear as in the John Lewis lineage?
well, my own "Victory is Assured" and "Who are You, Really" on my latest album are indebted to John Lewis (meaning the compositions rather than the playing). Uh I can't think of any larger instrumental works exhibiting that area of finesse and clarity. Maybe I should write some
I'm really glad you wrote that piece, and stuck with the more incendiary title. And I agree with you. I hope knowing you're right will help to protect you from the slings and arrows.
Different topic:
I am an amateur jazz pianist who bought my first real piano two years ago, a mid-90s Yamaha C7.
For years, I've been practicing on electric keyboards, and now the piano going out of tune is really bothering me when I'm playing. Obviously I can't have the tuner out every other week.
What's your advice for dealing with a slightly (and increasingly) out of tune piano in your practice routine?
I understand your question about pianos going out of tune, but I have learned not to let it bother me. That said, a home piano shouldn't need a new tuning more than every few months at the soonest. If it is really going badly out of tune quickly, that means there's a problem with the piano. (sorry to say)
But isn't the luxury of having an instrument to practice on that's 100% in tune all the time worth the Woolworth's tone of even the best of 'em? I'm not a pianist, but the weighted keys that Roland and Yamaha have come up with, adjustable in some cases, seem to compensate once more for the loss of the genuine resonance..
also not a pianist but doing my little Bach in the morning I play through Native Instruments sampled pianos which I think sound significantly more amazing than any piano in my apartment could ever hope to (concert hall acoustics and all). Plus a lot of variety.
I could see that if I were a pianist it would maybe screw me up. I'm on a $600ish casio which feels pretty great to me.
-- I saw the recent Porgy and Bess at the Met. I enjoyed it but it is the quintessential problematic piece, at times redolent of minstrelsy. Most of the music is great.
I hear you on the minstrelsy charges, but In my more charitable moods, I like to think of Gershwin as trying to respectfully honor his African-American source material ( given his own ideological limitations) more than not, and coming up with something more like an artistic synthesis. Otherwise, you'd have to wonder why so many black opera singers still adore the piece. BTW, I recently saw Malcolm X at the MET, which was astonishing.
I think if more had been written for black singers they would do less Porgy and Bess. This gets back to my article, and the idea that Gershwin paradoxically closed a door instead of opening one. "Porgy is there, so why commission something else?"
An intriguing What If: Gershwin came very close to writing an operatic version of The Dybbuk, from Yiddish folklore. Would have been closer to home, for sure! Wish it had happened.
I agree. The issue is as much local to the MET as broadly considered, given they only recently started embracing a more diverse compliment of contemporary operas ( many other opera house's which have been far more inclusive over the years). See Terrance Blanchard et al.
The wave of "Porgy and Bess" versions from about 1957-1962 is fascinating. The Hollywood film came out in 1959, but the wave in jazz anyway was well underway, with Miles/Gil Evans, the Bill Potts big band album, the Bethlehem set you mention, and many small-group tribute records. I guess records like "X plays music from 'My Fair Lady'" and other musicals were also very common in this era, but Porgy wasn't a commercial blockbuster or new at the time.
I wish Gershwin lived longer. I love RiB and always will. Yet, it’s almost juvenilia compared to his Concerto which he composed, orchestrated, and rehearsed within a year from RiB.. absolutely wild!
I wish he had been able to hear Ella interpret his songs, and to hear all the great instrumentalists play them. Or to hear what all those brilliant players and composers did with rhythm changes!
I think it would have been the greatest honor he could receive - to hear Miles’ band play But Not For Me or Monk playing Nice Work. I wish he could have heard it all.
Thanks! Truthfully, I need to go back and re-edit those essays, but I appreciate the comment very much. I listened to that bootleg and it was good, but I don’t remember very clearly. The magic is there. However, by that time I sort of think Old and New Dreams was the standard bearer for that tradition.
With Rachael Moorthy, I’m teaching a course on Taylor Swift’s lyrics at the University of Basel this semester. The full title is this: "Where all the poets went to die": Taylor Swift as Literature.
When I posted about the course on Facebook, several of my friends who are musicians and/or jazz fans complained about Swift’s music for being so harmonically simple and melodically repetitive. I didn’t bite because that’s not what the course is about.
But somehow that made me wonder if any jazz musicians have recorded jazz arrangements of Taylor Swift songs. Do you know of any, Ethan? But of course I can also ask all your readers if they know any.
(Please, if all you can think of saying is that Swift’s words and/or music are drivel, spare yourself and me – and Ethan – the time. That’s not what I’m asking about here.)
"complained about Swift’s music for being so harmonically simple and melodically repetitive."
I guess "C Jam Blues" and "Well You Needn't" are beyond the pale for these people. To answer your question, you could probably take a list of Swift's 10-15 most famous pieces (or the pieces you think are most likely to catch a jazz musican's ear), spend a few minutes on SecondhandSongs.com, and see if anything turns up.
Yes RIB is a masterpiece, yes the case can be convincingly made that it is the 'worst' among strong contenders i.e. Bolero and yes the NYT comments section is almost as toxic as X formerly Twitter, went through the comments and had a blast (obviously these shoot-from-the-hip commenters are more 'square' than TT readers and/or they failed to grasp the tongue-in-cheek nature of the piece.)
Hi Ethan. Hope you have a great gig tonight in BP. FYI, I studied in BP (‘91-‘92) at the Liszt Academy as a postgrad ( piano and chamber music) Used to hang with a lot of the jazzers too and often went to hear Pege Aladár’s qtet- he played Mingus’s old bass which was given to him by his widow I believe. A great musician who divided his time between the Liszt chamber orchestra and his qtet. It was a great time to be there just post ‘89. Crazy language too eg a double bass is a nagy bőgő ( lit a big moo) 😂
Shame your not taking in London this time round as I would have come and said hi.
Finally, Barry H would surely dig the opening of Ludwig’s Op 31 in G 1st Mvt ( a perfect bebop line over a iii-vi-ii-v-i. 😉
I remember Pege Aladár from a Mingus Dynasty album. Very cool. Thanks for kind words and I love the Beethoven of course! You are right that line is quite bebop! Actually it's one of my fav sonatas.
you posted tony oxley / Bailey / briars playing miles mode after oxley passed. Was wondering if you had any thoughts on Derek Bailey and if you had heard his recently released duo with Paul Motian.
Cheers on the album and particularly the Piano Sonata, which I enjoyed more than I was expecting.
Not as much as I would enjoy watching Conundrum, which leads me to my question this month: What is your favorite quiz show? Lately we've been enjoying House of Games and Cats Does Countdown (with it's own crucial Countdown Conundrums) and occasionally we can get a question right watching Only Connect.
Perhaps Strayhorn's masterful condensation might be compared to Gil Evans's rethinking of Concierto de Aranjuez? Rodrigo was apparently appalled by the "blasphemy." But I can't imagine any jazz listener, or serious student of composition, agreeing with him. Evans fleshed out the ideas that were merely hints in the "original," in particular turning the ominously static development section into a full-blown and coherent narrative. Perhaps Strayhorn, too, undertood the composer's ideas better than the composer...
nice comment
I think the prejudice persists, almost unconsciously, that classical composers, trained in Fux and Salieri, are per se more accomplished at dealing with musical form than their jazz counterparts, trained in, er, Skinnay Ennis and Billy May. Among the profusion of examples that confute this presumption, Gil Evans's rethinking of Rodrigo is toward the top of the heap..
Any comments on John Coltrane’s long form ASCENSION? It’s worth seeking out in the 2 CD box set The Major Works of John Coltrane because it has both takes (aka edition 1 & 2), the LP was issued, and then Coltrane changed his mind and asked Impulse to make subsequent pressings using the other take (which was done).
Yes I like it of course. In a way this is a good example of spontaneous form. John Tchicai's comparatively soft and lyrical solos change the feeling of the music entirely
As far as I know, the issue of long-form in jazz goes back to Andre Hodier at midcentury and got a lot of mileage out of discussion of Ellington's various suites. I've always thought the issue was ill-posed in some way, but I've never thought it through.
And then we have something like Mingus's Black Saint and Sinner Lady which was, in effect, composed in the editing bay. But then, many films get shaped the same way. I thinking particulary of Apocalypse Now, which never really had a screen play, and was edited into coherence after who knows how may thousands of feet of film was shot.
I can't imagine anyone would think that discussions of form in jazz, long form or otherwise, have been among the happier chapters in its discursive history. The routine sneering at the handling of form in Duke Ellington's Suites have been just as routinely--and rightly?--denounced as, well, extremely blinkered at best, and racist at worst.
At the risk of pretentiousness, I think the problem (or one of the principal ones) is a confusion of form and structure. Since the latter has always been basic and clear in most jazz, it has unwisely presumed to be equivalent to the former. Yet we all *know* that isn't so. To suggest that the "form" of "C Jam Blues" and "Chasin' the Train" are "the same" because they both involve the 12-bar blues *structure* is absurd. But we all do it; out of laziness, and out of the formidable challenge of disentangling musical form in its truest sense from the structures that enable it.
André Hodeir took something of an interesting step in the right direction in trying to differentiate the function of different choruses. He called what's normally called "playing the head" the "paraphrase chorus," and the succeeding choruses "improvising choruses" (something like that, I think; I don't have his book any more.) Calling that a paraphrase chorus instead of a "melody statement" sharply alters our view of its function in the whole performance. If only we could follow up on his insights, and figure out what the hell is going on *formally* with the rest of the choruses!
thanks for comment. It's true that long forms in jazz are problematic. In the end, what makes up so much of what I love in "modern jazz" is group interaction. In many cases long forms are developed organically, but there's hardly any terminology to discuss that.
Right. That is, a performance evolves so that it has a "long line" that no one planned or intended, but it's how things worked out. Working groups can arrive at such things and then re-enact them reliably on different occasions. But it doesn't have to be a working group. It can simply be a group who happen to be playing together and know how to listen and relate.
You call it a masterpiece! What more do people want?
You dig?
One thing I am a little perplexed by is calling "Handful of Keys" source material. To my ears (and hands), "Handful of Keys" (1929) is partially rooted in the so-called "novelty" piano stylings of Zez Confrey, Arthur Schutt, etc. "Kitten on the Keys" (1921) comes to mind. I hear it in other Fats Waller pieces, such as "Smashing Thirds" and pieces by other stride pianists. We know that Gershwin was also influenced by Zez Confrey and that Confrey was included in the 1924 Aeolian Hall concert where he played several of his pieces, including "Kitten on the Keys."
I'm not sure when Waller and Gershwin met, but I know they were friends and admired each other, so there must have been influence in both directions (perhaps "I Got Rhythm" comes from "Handful of Keys"?......I'd be interested to know when these changes first appeared). I find it hard to believe that Fats wasn't checking out "Rhapsody in Blue."
Is "Handful of Keys" better than "Rhapsody in Blue"? In my opinion, yes, by a mile. But "Handful" was also a piece for show, mixing novelty tricks into a stride piano foundation. I suppose calling it source material depends on the definition. Is it authoritative? Absolutely. Is it it original? Maybe?
Thanks for detailed comment. There's little doubt that Gershwin heard Waller in Harlem before composing the Rhapsody. However, the particular point Aaron Diehl is raising relates to SOURCE in terms of RHYTHM. Most classical pianists couldn't play more than a few beats of any of those three pieces. Waller had one of the best feels, and "Handful of Keys" is a virtuoso example of Waller's groove. That's the puzzle piece -- the source -- we all need to study to keep American music moving forward.
I dig Zez Confrey and Arthur Schutt too, BTW. So much great piano music from that era.
Oh, I just realized that today is James P. Johnson's birthday!
Ok, for some reason, it wasn't clear to me that we were only talking about rhythm, but I do agree that Fats had one of the best (if not THE best) grooves in history.
I was considering the harmonic/melodic picture, as well. I think there's a tendency to talk about the European influence on jazz harmony while overlooking the harmonic sophistication and originality of musicians like James P Johnson and Fats Waller. I think of them as both rhythmic and harmonic sources. I've probably learned half of what I know about harmony from James P. Johnson.
I guess that's why I pick on "Handful of Keys" a bit, because harmonically and melodically, it's in the realm of novelty works by people like Confrey and Gershwin. Fats was also a harmonic giant, and there are many better examples of his full scope. How about that solo version of "Honeysuckle Rose" from 1941? Or his hauntingly beautiful "My Fate is In Your Hands"?
Maybe it's just me being tired of hearing about "Handful of Keys" when Fats Waller gave us so much more.
BTW, thanks for opening up this conversation! It's a good one!
Well those pieces were Aaron's choices. I doubt he thought about much about it one way or the other in the quick interview. I'm sure we all love the harmony AND the rhythm of these great masters.
OK my case for the Beethoven 9th Symphony finale rests on the bit where the soloists sing "... And the cherubs will stand before God," and he has them repeat, "BEFORE GOD!" And then everything stops and a damned Turkish parade comes right through the middle of the piece. Which to me is Beethoven saying, "I mean it about how we'll all get our face time with God," and is basically Mahler avant la lettre.
nice comment, Paul!
Bachianas Brasileiras No. 5 has always been a favorite. A la Rodrigo/Gil Evans, there have been a number of interpretations by jazz artists. Bradford's version followed the "light classical" approach, as promised in the label name --- a respectable but mainstream performance. The Modern Jazz Quartet definitely took a jazzier tack, but it's clunky to my ears. The best interpretation I've heard is Wayne Shorter's take on his "Alegria" album 20 years ago. It's a hybrid, with a gorgeous cello ensemble and Wayne soaring in an improvisation on the melody. I did it in a recital a couple of decades ago and couldn't hit that last high note today if I tried. Are there other versions out there that transform it but stay true to its Brazilian origins? Is it in your repertoire?
That is a beautiful piece and you’re right about the connection to the jazz musicians. I’ve never played it myself. The (original?) version with cellos is breathtaking
(Unrelated to the above) People still namecheck and respect John Lewis, but I don't hear his musical influence as much as I might like, especially in terms of composition and arrangement (rather than piano playing). For EI or anyone else, can you recommend contemporary composers or recordings that you hear as in the John Lewis lineage?
well, my own "Victory is Assured" and "Who are You, Really" on my latest album are indebted to John Lewis (meaning the compositions rather than the playing). Uh I can't think of any larger instrumental works exhibiting that area of finesse and clarity. Maybe I should write some
I haven't listened to your new one yet, and thank you for this highly personalized plug!!!
My first thought after reading the Times article was, “He’s gonna get roasted in the comments!”
If only I was as accurate with my NFL picks this weekend......
I'm really glad you wrote that piece, and stuck with the more incendiary title. And I agree with you. I hope knowing you're right will help to protect you from the slings and arrows.
Different topic:
I am an amateur jazz pianist who bought my first real piano two years ago, a mid-90s Yamaha C7.
For years, I've been practicing on electric keyboards, and now the piano going out of tune is really bothering me when I'm playing. Obviously I can't have the tuner out every other week.
What's your advice for dealing with a slightly (and increasingly) out of tune piano in your practice routine?
thanks so much for kind words.
I understand your question about pianos going out of tune, but I have learned not to let it bother me. That said, a home piano shouldn't need a new tuning more than every few months at the soonest. If it is really going badly out of tune quickly, that means there's a problem with the piano. (sorry to say)
But isn't the luxury of having an instrument to practice on that's 100% in tune all the time worth the Woolworth's tone of even the best of 'em? I'm not a pianist, but the weighted keys that Roland and Yamaha have come up with, adjustable in some cases, seem to compensate once more for the loss of the genuine resonance..
also not a pianist but doing my little Bach in the morning I play through Native Instruments sampled pianos which I think sound significantly more amazing than any piano in my apartment could ever hope to (concert hall acoustics and all). Plus a lot of variety.
I could see that if I were a pianist it would maybe screw me up. I'm on a $600ish casio which feels pretty great to me.
Did I mention not a pianist?
Hi, Ethan! Two very unrelated questions, if I may:
- What are your thoughts on Porgy and Bess as a composition?
- I’ve been reading Shirley Jackson stories of late, after having only been exposed to The Lottery in school. Any thoughts on Jackson?
Thanks!
-- I saw the recent Porgy and Bess at the Met. I enjoyed it but it is the quintessential problematic piece, at times redolent of minstrelsy. Most of the music is great.
I hear you on the minstrelsy charges, but In my more charitable moods, I like to think of Gershwin as trying to respectfully honor his African-American source material ( given his own ideological limitations) more than not, and coming up with something more like an artistic synthesis. Otherwise, you'd have to wonder why so many black opera singers still adore the piece. BTW, I recently saw Malcolm X at the MET, which was astonishing.
I think if more had been written for black singers they would do less Porgy and Bess. This gets back to my article, and the idea that Gershwin paradoxically closed a door instead of opening one. "Porgy is there, so why commission something else?"
An intriguing What If: Gershwin came very close to writing an operatic version of The Dybbuk, from Yiddish folklore. Would have been closer to home, for sure! Wish it had happened.
I agree. The issue is as much local to the MET as broadly considered, given they only recently started embracing a more diverse compliment of contemporary operas ( many other opera house's which have been far more inclusive over the years). See Terrance Blanchard et al.
I remember some version of it on TV when I was a kid. And then there's a curious jazz version issued on Bethlehem in the 1950s.
The wave of "Porgy and Bess" versions from about 1957-1962 is fascinating. The Hollywood film came out in 1959, but the wave in jazz anyway was well underway, with Miles/Gil Evans, the Bill Potts big band album, the Bethlehem set you mention, and many small-group tribute records. I guess records like "X plays music from 'My Fair Lady'" and other musicals were also very common in this era, but Porgy wasn't a commercial blockbuster or new at the time.
That was Ellington's reaction, too. He was much peeved with Gershwin about that..
I wish Gershwin lived longer. I love RiB and always will. Yet, it’s almost juvenilia compared to his Concerto which he composed, orchestrated, and rehearsed within a year from RiB.. absolutely wild!
I wish he had been able to hear Ella interpret his songs, and to hear all the great instrumentalists play them. Or to hear what all those brilliant players and composers did with rhythm changes!
I think it would have been the greatest honor he could receive - to hear Miles’ band play But Not For Me or Monk playing Nice Work. I wish he could have heard it all.
Nice comment!
Hello!
I'ma big fan of your essays on Ornette, they really changed my understanding of that music and that of the folks in that orbit.
I'd be fascinated to hear your thoughts on the bootleg(s?) of the 1990 gig in Italy with the original quartet with Higgins...
Thanks! Truthfully, I need to go back and re-edit those essays, but I appreciate the comment very much. I listened to that bootleg and it was good, but I don’t remember very clearly. The magic is there. However, by that time I sort of think Old and New Dreams was the standard bearer for that tradition.
With Rachael Moorthy, I’m teaching a course on Taylor Swift’s lyrics at the University of Basel this semester. The full title is this: "Where all the poets went to die": Taylor Swift as Literature.
When I posted about the course on Facebook, several of my friends who are musicians and/or jazz fans complained about Swift’s music for being so harmonically simple and melodically repetitive. I didn’t bite because that’s not what the course is about.
But somehow that made me wonder if any jazz musicians have recorded jazz arrangements of Taylor Swift songs. Do you know of any, Ethan? But of course I can also ask all your readers if they know any.
(Please, if all you can think of saying is that Swift’s words and/or music are drivel, spare yourself and me – and Ethan – the time. That’s not what I’m asking about here.)
Nothing comes to mind, but surely it exists!!!
"complained about Swift’s music for being so harmonically simple and melodically repetitive."
I guess "C Jam Blues" and "Well You Needn't" are beyond the pale for these people. To answer your question, you could probably take a list of Swift's 10-15 most famous pieces (or the pieces you think are most likely to catch a jazz musican's ear), spend a few minutes on SecondhandSongs.com, and see if anything turns up.
This is tongue-in-cheek, as Postmodern Jukebox arrangements always are, but Caity Gyorgy turns in a really nice performance:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VFFQrdOpNY0
Thanks so much! A great performance.
Yes RIB is a masterpiece, yes the case can be convincingly made that it is the 'worst' among strong contenders i.e. Bolero and yes the NYT comments section is almost as toxic as X formerly Twitter, went through the comments and had a blast (obviously these shoot-from-the-hip commenters are more 'square' than TT readers and/or they failed to grasp the tongue-in-cheek nature of the piece.)
Indeed!!
Hi Ethan. Hope you have a great gig tonight in BP. FYI, I studied in BP (‘91-‘92) at the Liszt Academy as a postgrad ( piano and chamber music) Used to hang with a lot of the jazzers too and often went to hear Pege Aladár’s qtet- he played Mingus’s old bass which was given to him by his widow I believe. A great musician who divided his time between the Liszt chamber orchestra and his qtet. It was a great time to be there just post ‘89. Crazy language too eg a double bass is a nagy bőgő ( lit a big moo) 😂
Shame your not taking in London this time round as I would have come and said hi.
Finally, Barry H would surely dig the opening of Ludwig’s Op 31 in G 1st Mvt ( a perfect bebop line over a iii-vi-ii-v-i. 😉
Love the album!🙏
I remember Pege Aladár from a Mingus Dynasty album. Very cool. Thanks for kind words and I love the Beethoven of course! You are right that line is quite bebop! Actually it's one of my fav sonatas.
you posted tony oxley / Bailey / briars playing miles mode after oxley passed. Was wondering if you had any thoughts on Derek Bailey and if you had heard his recently released duo with Paul Motian.
honestly I haven't heard much Derek Bailey but I know he is great.
Cheers on the album and particularly the Piano Sonata, which I enjoyed more than I was expecting.
Not as much as I would enjoy watching Conundrum, which leads me to my question this month: What is your favorite quiz show? Lately we've been enjoying House of Games and Cats Does Countdown (with it's own crucial Countdown Conundrums) and occasionally we can get a question right watching Only Connect.
hah! Thanks. I'm proud of both the Sonata and "Conundrum." Honestly I never watched that many quiz shows. I guess my very banal answer is Jeopardy.