The conversation about Shorter's work in the Jazz Messengers with Lee Morgan summoned up in my mind an image of a black-and-white photograph of the two of them from around 1959 or 1960. Morgan is on the left of the photo, blowing hard on his trumpet which is pointed down in front of Shorter on the right. Shorter looks very young in this image -- seemingly just 19 or 20. He's holding his sax, not playing it, but looking down toward Morgan. His mouth is open and his jaw has dropped, as if he's in awe of what he's hearing coming out of Morgan's trumpet and amazed of what being in that band is enabling him to hear.
I searched on the internet for that image this morning, but couldn't find it. I have a hunch that I saw it in the 2016 documentary film, "I Called Him Morgan." Shorter looks so young in that photo that I came to believe that he must have been a teenage prodigy to join the Messengers at such a young age.
Ethan's now 10-year-old post, however, exposes the errors in my thinking. He was not a teen prodigy; he only began playing in his mid-teens. He joined the Messengers in 1959 when he was about 26, when he already had a college degree in music education, had spent two years in the U.S. Army and had been a gigging musician for several years. Morgan joined the Messengers in 1958 but was actually nearly five years younger than Shorter. (See the Wikipedia articles on each.) Thanks for re-posting this interview. It has made me wonder what I've been projecting into that photo of Shorter and Morgan for the past decade.
I always thought Wayne and Warne. Somewhere I have copies of Wayne tunes in his hand that Jimmy Rowles copied for a friend of mine. DM I int.
I went to the Smithsonian around 10 years ago to study and copy Ellington arrangements and I was delighted to see that some charts were labeled for the players rather than the instruments.
Said a lot to me.
That's why I went to every Motian show I could get to at the Vanguard. No matter if he had three guitars and no bass or one horn and two guitars it always worked. Bill Frisell said that once he realized that he wasn't hired just as a guitarist but for who he was things opened up.
That's a fine and fascinating interview, Ethan. Thanks for reposting it. Am I imagining that he twice ducks the opportunity to talk about Freddie Hubbard?
Thank you so much for resharing from 2015, Ethan. Mr. Shorter and the community with whom performed inspired more broadly than they may have realized. Separately, would you like me to interview YOU someday?
I can't believe how incredible and nourishing this interview is. I keep coming back to it. Wayne is such a deep, profound, beautiful human being. And all these stories and anecdotes -- my god. It's a reminder for how to live a true and purposeful life when forces all around us (always) are trying to corrupt our better angels. Or something. Huge gratitude. More personal thoughts (on Wayne, on this interview, on jazz, etc.) here: https://murphlaw.substack.com/p/wayne-shorter-on-thelonious-monk
I was on Jazz on 3 talking about Mostly Other People Do the Killing in October 2014 -- it was a real loss when that show ended, and for some reason I associate it with a shift in the "jazz internet," along with the end of the jazz link roundups from Patrick Jarenwattananon at NPR. Thanks so much for sharing this. I'm always fascinated by Wayne's history with cartooning (along with John Updike, Hugh Hefner, etc.), it's awesome to have some more insight into that here!
I think you are right on about the end of the original cool jazz Internet at that time. It wasn’t just jazz, either: Social media sort of generally destroyed something a bit more innocent from the early years.
The conversation about Shorter's work in the Jazz Messengers with Lee Morgan summoned up in my mind an image of a black-and-white photograph of the two of them from around 1959 or 1960. Morgan is on the left of the photo, blowing hard on his trumpet which is pointed down in front of Shorter on the right. Shorter looks very young in this image -- seemingly just 19 or 20. He's holding his sax, not playing it, but looking down toward Morgan. His mouth is open and his jaw has dropped, as if he's in awe of what he's hearing coming out of Morgan's trumpet and amazed of what being in that band is enabling him to hear.
I searched on the internet for that image this morning, but couldn't find it. I have a hunch that I saw it in the 2016 documentary film, "I Called Him Morgan." Shorter looks so young in that photo that I came to believe that he must have been a teenage prodigy to join the Messengers at such a young age.
Ethan's now 10-year-old post, however, exposes the errors in my thinking. He was not a teen prodigy; he only began playing in his mid-teens. He joined the Messengers in 1959 when he was about 26, when he already had a college degree in music education, had spent two years in the U.S. Army and had been a gigging musician for several years. Morgan joined the Messengers in 1958 but was actually nearly five years younger than Shorter. (See the Wikipedia articles on each.) Thanks for re-posting this interview. It has made me wonder what I've been projecting into that photo of Shorter and Morgan for the past decade.
Thank you you elicited some great information .
I always thought Wayne and Warne. Somewhere I have copies of Wayne tunes in his hand that Jimmy Rowles copied for a friend of mine. DM I int.
I went to the Smithsonian around 10 years ago to study and copy Ellington arrangements and I was delighted to see that some charts were labeled for the players rather than the instruments.
Said a lot to me.
That's why I went to every Motian show I could get to at the Vanguard. No matter if he had three guitars and no bass or one horn and two guitars it always worked. Bill Frisell said that once he realized that he wasn't hired just as a guitarist but for who he was things opened up.
A lesson I identified with going forward.
That's a fine and fascinating interview, Ethan. Thanks for reposting it. Am I imagining that he twice ducks the opportunity to talk about Freddie Hubbard?
There were a few names that he never really responded to. Hubbard he ignored; he also ignored Cedar Walton. (I took that part out.)
Thank you so much for resharing from 2015, Ethan. Mr. Shorter and the community with whom performed inspired more broadly than they may have realized. Separately, would you like me to interview YOU someday?
Well I'm happy to talk anytime, but I think I would be self-conscious about publishing an interview with myself on TT. Thanks Ryn!
Sure, Ethan. I agree that TT would not be the right place to publish.
When is the next time you'll be in New York for a talk over coffee? I think my email is in the info you have for all your subscribers.
Looking forward.
Wow. Thank you for posting this. Wayne Shorter could have called his autobiography "What If", his open mind and his weaving stories here, so great.
I can't believe how incredible and nourishing this interview is. I keep coming back to it. Wayne is such a deep, profound, beautiful human being. And all these stories and anecdotes -- my god. It's a reminder for how to live a true and purposeful life when forces all around us (always) are trying to corrupt our better angels. Or something. Huge gratitude. More personal thoughts (on Wayne, on this interview, on jazz, etc.) here: https://murphlaw.substack.com/p/wayne-shorter-on-thelonious-monk
Cheers,
Murph
I was on Jazz on 3 talking about Mostly Other People Do the Killing in October 2014 -- it was a real loss when that show ended, and for some reason I associate it with a shift in the "jazz internet," along with the end of the jazz link roundups from Patrick Jarenwattananon at NPR. Thanks so much for sharing this. I'm always fascinated by Wayne's history with cartooning (along with John Updike, Hugh Hefner, etc.), it's awesome to have some more insight into that here!
I think you are right on about the end of the original cool jazz Internet at that time. It wasn’t just jazz, either: Social media sort of generally destroyed something a bit more innocent from the early years.